One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

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One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby peter212693 » Mon Jul 16, 2012 8:48 pm

Hello all,

Ive had my neons just under a week, I have 12 of them but spotted a tiny spot on one of the tails. The fish seems fine, sticking with others and swimming around can you advise? Is this just a blemish?

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-J8WFGWq ... e=youtu.be
12 Neon Tetras
8 Rummynose Tertas
1 Bristlenose Plec
5 Cherry Barbs (2 Males 3 Females)
6 Five Banded Barbs
6 Zebra Danios
5 Harlequin Rasboras
6 Zebra Loaches
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Re: One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby san-ho-zay » Mon Jul 16, 2012 11:30 pm

Little marks like that are not uncommon but keep an eye on it. If you see more on different fish, or repeated signs of irritation like scratching and flicking against things, let us know.
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Re: One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby peter212693 » Mon Jul 16, 2012 11:39 pm

Thank you once again!

It does seem normal, infact checking again it does seem to have gone now. I will keep a very close eye on them all over the next few days. I do like to be over cautious!
12 Neon Tetras
8 Rummynose Tertas
1 Bristlenose Plec
5 Cherry Barbs (2 Males 3 Females)
6 Five Banded Barbs
6 Zebra Danios
5 Harlequin Rasboras
6 Zebra Loaches
peter212693
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Re: One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby ItWentWhereverIdidGo » Tue Jul 17, 2012 8:20 am

If it's whitespot you're worried about then your clown loach would be the first to get it.
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Re: One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby peter212693 » Thu Jul 19, 2012 7:01 pm

We may have a problem here. One of my clown loaches seems to have 2 spots on it, a cherry barb has two spots and is flashing against the bog wood and two of the five banded barbs are flashing too but have no viable spots

:(
12 Neon Tetras
8 Rummynose Tertas
1 Bristlenose Plec
5 Cherry Barbs (2 Males 3 Females)
6 Five Banded Barbs
6 Zebra Danios
5 Harlequin Rasboras
6 Zebra Loaches
peter212693
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Re: One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby san-ho-zay » Thu Jul 19, 2012 7:25 pm

Not good news at all. The combination of spots and behaviour suggests you have to get on with it now and treat quickly...

Once you have sourced a treatment, gradually increase the temperature toward 30*C. Do it gradually and if any fish show signs of discomfort, stop and back off slightly.

Gravel vacs helps by removing the tomont phase (the one that reproduces in the substrate).

Don't use salt with loaches.

Choose a whitespot treatment like Waterlife Protozin or Esha Exit. These seem to be the most well respected. Follow the guide along with these instructions: http://forums.loaches.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=16721

Also: http://www.fishkeeping.co.uk/articles_88/white-spot.htm

These treatments should be filter safe but it might also be worth getting a bottle of Seachem Prime in case you get a mini-cycle.
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Re: One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby peter212693 » Thu Jul 19, 2012 7:31 pm

I will get some treatment on my lunch tomorrow and start treatment after work tomorrow

:(
12 Neon Tetras
8 Rummynose Tertas
1 Bristlenose Plec
5 Cherry Barbs (2 Males 3 Females)
6 Five Banded Barbs
6 Zebra Danios
5 Harlequin Rasboras
6 Zebra Loaches
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Re: One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby peter212693 » Thu Jul 19, 2012 11:53 pm

Its really weird the fish that seemed to have spots earlier, some still have then and one cherry barb does not. Just fed them all too and where all very greedy which is confusing me..

I dont want to add chemicals if not needed but then dont want my fish to suffer...., flashing seems to have stopped too
12 Neon Tetras
8 Rummynose Tertas
1 Bristlenose Plec
5 Cherry Barbs (2 Males 3 Females)
6 Five Banded Barbs
6 Zebra Danios
5 Harlequin Rasboras
6 Zebra Loaches
peter212693
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Re: One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby san-ho-zay » Fri Jul 20, 2012 12:30 am

The spots aren't permanent with whitespot. The spot is where the parasite feeds off the fish. When it's gorged itself, it falls off and reproduces by division inside a cyst on the substrate. When this bursts, it releases thousands of free-swimming parasites. These attach to fish, forming new spots, and the cycle continues but in increasing intensity until the fish become really ill with it, especially when it infects their gills.

There is a balance between treating unnecessarily and treating promptly. This is always the problem with whitespot -- is it or isn't it? If it is, it will get worse quickly. No whitespot medication should kill healthy fish, but whitespot will if it's not treated. You have seen both symptoms -- the spots and the irritation.

You can't do anything until you get the meds, which I still recommend you get. Have a look at some photos of whitespot -- it looks like grains of salt with a definite raised appearance, e.g.

http://www.aqua.stir.ac.uk/parasitology ... ophthirius
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Re: One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby peter212693 » Fri Jul 20, 2012 8:43 am

One of my clowns now has about 6 spots this morning. I will get some treatment in the way home tonight and start treating the tank :(
12 Neon Tetras
8 Rummynose Tertas
1 Bristlenose Plec
5 Cherry Barbs (2 Males 3 Females)
6 Five Banded Barbs
6 Zebra Danios
5 Harlequin Rasboras
6 Zebra Loaches
peter212693
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Re: One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby peter212693 » Fri Jul 20, 2012 4:59 pm

Got some protozin today so going to start treatment tonight. I will change my normal 30% change and vac the gravel and start treating. The dosage says does 4ml per 60l but to half it if the tank is new? Would you recommend half dosage or go for full?
12 Neon Tetras
8 Rummynose Tertas
1 Bristlenose Plec
5 Cherry Barbs (2 Males 3 Females)
6 Five Banded Barbs
6 Zebra Danios
5 Harlequin Rasboras
6 Zebra Loaches
peter212693
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Posts: 96
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2012 9:01 pm

Re: One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby san-ho-zay » Fri Jul 20, 2012 5:24 pm

I managed to find this thread on Loaches Online, which was at the back of my mind but I couldn't find before:

http://forums.loaches.com/viewtopic.php ... t=protozin

Emma Turner is well respected, especially in terms of loach keeping, and suggests splitting whatever dose it suggests for a day into two parts, dosed approximately 12 hours apart.

EDIT: Don't forget to take any carbon out of your filter before you dose the Protozin. It will reduce its effectiveness. Be careful with it -- wash your hands and be careful when siphoning.
Richard
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Re: One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby peter212693 » Fri Jul 20, 2012 6:41 pm

First dose all done :(

Did my water change and removed carbon from the filter
I have added a bit more biomax to use the space of the carbon to help the bacteria breed. I will half does from tomorrow morning and at night as suggested.

Is it worth raisin the temp a little its currently 25.3 degrees
12 Neon Tetras
8 Rummynose Tertas
1 Bristlenose Plec
5 Cherry Barbs (2 Males 3 Females)
6 Five Banded Barbs
6 Zebra Danios
5 Harlequin Rasboras
6 Zebra Loaches
peter212693
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Posts: 96
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2012 9:01 pm

Re: One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby san-ho-zay » Fri Jul 20, 2012 7:09 pm

OK. The most important thing with whitespot now is to follow the schedule.

The medication will only kill the free swimming stage. So the spots have to "fall" from the fish, they will reproduce in the substrate and when the cysts burst, the protozoa that would attach to the fish are killed off. You should see the spots decline but the treatment has to run its course, maintaining the medication in the water to kill any free-swimmers that get released from the spots that are there now.

EDIT: The idea of raising the temperature is to speed up the lifecycle so that the free-swimmers come into contact with the medication but I've seen conflicting advice on whether this is always a good thing. The thing to avoid is stressing the fish -- maybe a little increase to 26-27*C but watch for signs of gasping?

How are the fish looking?
Richard
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Re: One Neon Tertra with one spot on tail

Postby peter212693 » Fri Jul 20, 2012 7:20 pm

They where ok when I got in from work, and during the water change they where all out and even playing in the splashing of the new water which is good. They have all gone a bit wild after putting the treatment in which is a bit worrying just hope they will settle down. Acting a bit like they did when I first added them to the tank.

No gasping at the moment always have an air stone in the tank running so should be plenty of oxygen. I will raise it to 26 degrees then, I take it the zebra danios will be ok at that temp?

Its a 4 day treatment with a 3 day gap at the end according to the bottle so this is day one 12 hour doses tomorrow and sunday then another final does on Wednesday. If I see another spot after this should I run the 4 day course again?
12 Neon Tetras
8 Rummynose Tertas
1 Bristlenose Plec
5 Cherry Barbs (2 Males 3 Females)
6 Five Banded Barbs
6 Zebra Danios
5 Harlequin Rasboras
6 Zebra Loaches
peter212693
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Posts: 96
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2012 9:01 pm

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